User talk:Cizagna/Archive/01

Welcome to my talk page. Please put new messages at the end. Please note that I might reply on this page, or I might reply on your own talk page. If you have a preference for where I reply, please let me know.

Signing
You asked how to sign : use the button before the last one in the editor or this code --~ --Tyrcho 11:39, 11 July 2006 (UTC) Thanks i discover the, ~ but your is great also --Cizagna 14:21, 11 July 2006 (UTC)

Thanks
Thanks for the support on my administrator candidacy. Regarding the comment you retracted, I bet you got Tandi and Tavi mixed up... it happens often. :) --TaviRider 18:14, 17 July 2006 (UTC)
 * I saw the TaviRider on top of the modification (i normaly see only the difference between pages) and thought that you modify it... but then i took another look and it was the line of the summary.

Forgetfulness Potion
Well i have corrected most of the forgetfulness potions to the Spell loss potion but what do i do with the items that where use to craft them? Kitten Tails, Stamina belt, Valuable Ring, Iop crusher, Invisible Chafer bone, Magical Cure, Will-o'-the-wisp's Wand, Gobball horn, Gobball War Chief' leather (that has a incorrect thing i will check later), Royal Gobball leather, Cockleshell, etc..

should i delet any info on the item pages that they where use for making the potion, or should i create a note on the items telling they where use for creating that potion previus to X.XX version? --Cizagna 01:06, 11 August 2006 (UTC)


 * It's somewhat interesting to keep around the historical uses, but we should definitely make sure that every such use is clearly marked to show that it is no longer available, and link to the current way to obtain the potion. If we leave the historical information it will prevent confusion by people who wonder why some objects have no known uses. --TaviRider 02:04, 11 August 2006 (UTC)


 * Although they are interesting as historical records, it was not inteded for them to be kept on the main item page, see User talk:Dashiva for reasons. The recipes will be kept in their original page: Spell Loss Potion.  It is much too confusing to leave them on the items they are right now, unless marked in the least. - MrMunchie 16:09, 19 December 2006 (UTC)

Format on User:Rinar page
Thanks, mate. I love the new list. Makes it so much easier to read. Rinar 22:45, 18 October 2006 (UTC)

Reply to osamodas question
he made 2 joe style guides, remove one of them since they are literality the same (i rather have them both deleted since they are a disgrace to the osamodas race -_-) Tarquin-Mitzi 18:26, 19 October 2006 (UTC)

Report of varius Vandalize
Hope This is where i talk to you but the farmerset,bwork dungeon and various pages have been vandelised by http://dofus.wikia.com/index.php?title=Special:Contributions&target=216.224.121.141 User:PoundingBlood

Your Suggestions
Thank you for the cronstructive critisms. I have cranked down my Res and agree. I have made adjustments of removing the "Type" line from the Sadida page. I will contiue to improve the wiki in any way that I can. I belive most of my modifications are improvements, but if you feel there is an issue feel free to let me know again.

Ads
Do you think all of www.igsky.com should be blocked from advertising here or are there more specific URLs you'd rather block? Angela talk 02:32, 3 November 2006 (UTC)


 * Thanks for your reply. I'll ban the whole address. I think it's important that the ads don't upset Dofus wiki editors. Angela talk 06:33, 3 November 2006 (UTC)

History purpuse
All this is located at w:user talk:Angela. The webpage address in question has been removed to avoid problems:
 * {| border="1"

Wikia:c:dofus Advert 


 * Dofus Kamas Super Store : Buy DoFus Kamas, Fast Delivery 24/7 Online Support, 10000+ Paypal LINKREMOVED

In the Ads by Google on Wikia:c:dofus I have spot this Ads above, that breaks the rules of Dofus on Terms & Condition. Even thought I did not find specific wording, "Kamas" are the game currency (money/cash) and this page is selling that money in exchange for real money making profit with the intelectual property of Amakna Studios owner of the Dofus program if I'm correct... Also it may be apearing in other Wikias as it has other games where it gives the same service. So if it could be remove would be great Thanks! --Cizagna (Talk) 02:21, 3 November 2006 (UTC)


 * I'll reply on the dofus wiki. Angela talk 02:31, 3 November 2006 (UTC)


 * I have review the web page before I answer your question:
 * For a specific URL will be http://www. LINKREMOVED .com/class.php?gameid=25&gamename=DOFUS&state=1 this is the URL more accurate one that affects us more to the Dofus Wikia (if they notice, they could just change the "gameide=25" for another number)
 * For terms of what the page is offering : Is a way to cheat in-game, they offer 2 kind of services one is exchange game money for real money (includes Dofus game) that is considerate a cheating way in various games and second is that they will play with your character and level it for you by just giving them real money (does not include this service for Dofus game at the moment) so then the person that bought this just enjoys the benefits of a higher level character. Both of those services are ban reasons if the player is caught (still have not found a game that permits this conduct). And there is a chance that the deal is a scam/fraud and once they get the real money they will not deliver the electronic money or your account for the second service, so the user can't complain to the game developer company because, player has try to make and illegal benefit and it's not a service provided by game developer company or accepted by them. As they don't provide other thing aside from cheating on MMORPG's I would say ban the whole address.
 * Now putting my self in your point of view (as you have to be careful), what would I require to make this request stronger or more acceptable? Or should I try to obtain something official from the company developer of Dofus?--Cizagna (Talk) 04:44, 3 November 2006 (UTC)


 * I'll ban the whole address. I think it's important that the ads don't upset Dofus wiki editors. Angela talk 06:34, 3 November 2006 (UTC)
 * Thanks for all your help Angela =) --Cizagna (Talk) 21:22, 3 November 2006 (UTC)


 * }


 * I don't know where to publish a policy like this, but I think it should be a fundamental policy that this wiki will not document things that violate the Dofus terms of service. This includes cheats and abuses, scams, kamas for sale, and so on. It should also not link to sites that provide this information. Also forbidden are links to sites that do provide the above information. To enforce this, we should give a user a stern warning for posting cheats, with a 1 month ban for a second offense. Anyone posting advertisements of other sites, like kamas for sale or character auctions, should be an immediate permanent ban. --TaviRider 23:53, 3 November 2006 (UTC)
 * As we don't have a specific pages where our Rules are arrange or compile for now the best place is Dofus:What the Dofus Wikia is not, as part of my multiple projects on development, is to create one page where our rules should be applied but for now it's best is we use the Dofus:Community Portal page for that sort of stuff. --Cizagna (Talk) 03:44, 4 November 2006 (UTC)

Ranges
I like what you're doing with the set pages, but I'd prefer the 1-10 style of stat ranges, rather than 1~10. In English notation the latter usually means an approximation. --TaviRider 03:34, 7 November 2006 (UTC)
 * The reason I choose the Tilde “~” was because we already using the en dash “-“ (or hyphen) for the negative ones even thought I’m marking it color red, its more easy to differentiate using the tilde, and avoid possible confuse when handling the negative information. As a side note the approximation term it’s apply in mathematics when the number is alone example ~10 would mean "approximately 10". --Cizagna (Talk) 01:17, 8 November 2006 (UTC)

I don't like the new format at all and prefer the older one much better. If you want to introduce a new format, at the least try to make it consistent with the basic Wikipedia format. --61.202.37.250 13:32, 14 November 2006 (UTC)
 * I would love that you could do a more constructive critic and give examples as I'm not that familiar with main page and still exploring it as the information its sometimes disperse in many pages and hard to find. As for why I did it, please read Dofus:Community Portal/Sets, Talk:Treechnid_Set, Talk:Set] and User talk:Cizagna/SetProyect, where different subjects of the total project are develop, and that this has been on process for more than 3 months, with rather no objection. As for now once the link discussion is finish (for some possible bug fixes) I will continue as the community is not against it (or possible change it depends on your answer and possible acknowledgment from the community). --Cizagna (Talk) 02:17, 16 November 2006 (UTC)

About my expermental Template
But if you look, i wanted the template to be simple for the end user to use, like

{ {setBonus } }
 * 2=+whatever
 * 3=+whatever

once i understand thay system, i want to make one { {setItems etc etc } } and though a slightly complex system, itl see whats there and whats not amd display the right suff, and maby if you can parse things(i dun think u can) then itl set - stats red
 * hat=(name)
 * lvl=10
 * stats=(whatever)
 * belt=(name)

and such. But im unable to understand the wikis prmimitivie programng system ><.

And i was bord, i wanted to do something to help a little, so i redid the wabbit set stuff, soet of like what u had been doing.

Promotion
Congratulations! Now that sannse has made me a bureaucrat on this wiki, I was able to finally promote you to admin. Thanks for all your good work here! I suggest you get in touch with the folks at the wikia IRC channel. They seem to always be online, and they're very helpful. It's at chat.freenode.net, in the #wikia channel. --TaviRider 11:04, 9 November 2006 (UTC)
 * Thank you very much I will keep working like I have do =), i will check the IRC thing for faster feed back on certain things. --Cizagna (Talk) 16:54, 9 November 2006 (UTC)

Congratulations indeed. Keep up the good work =) // Peet talk 15:52, 9 November 2006 (UTC)
 * Thanks for the support =) --Cizagna (Talk) 16:54, 9 November 2006 (UTC)

Ads
Hi. Did you make this edit or is someone else changing your text? Angela talk 17:11, 12 November 2006 (UTC)
 * Already answer you in your talk page --Cizagna (Talk) 19:47, 12 November 2006 (UTC)
 * Thanks for your reply. igsky and gogoer are both now blocked, but there seem to be hundreds of new sites like this appearing every day. It might be better to just warn users about this in project:about since blocking one only seems to make way for a new one. Angela talk 09:31, 14 November 2006 (UTC)

Metaria images
I know the images of "Image:Green_triam_metaria.gif" and "Image:Yellow_triam_metaria.gif" were not in correct color, but it is not because I mixed them up, its because they are messed up in the game. The green is actually yellow in the game and yellow is green. I have no idea if the developers intend to fix it as its not something important. For all I know they may have done it intentionally to confuse players. I uploaded the pictures as they appear in the game. - Fogleg 14:16, 16 November 2006 (UTC)
 * Since a week ago the images have been finally corrected in-game so no further modification its require and the change i made stays like that --Cizagna (Talk) 04:07, 18 December 2006 (UTC)

Descriptions in Templates
Not sure how to use the user talk, but here goes:

Thanks for answering my query ('why doesn't the description variable work'), and good template. Also, I copied the code directly from the Robber Daggers, so I'm surprised it didn't work. Can you tell me why? -- J-Bizzle talk 18:59, 17 November 2006 (UTC)
 * I will respond you in your user page --Cizagna (Talk) 19:10, 17 November 2006 (UTC)

Minotoror
I have been working on the Minotoror page, but I am having a hard time choosing between the two tables I made. Could you give it a look-see when you get a chance? I put both tables on this page Talk:Minotoror, you can respond there or my talk page, either is fine with me. --TM-Dart 00:03, 27 November 2006 (UTC)

F2P Scroll exchange
I went there and there'snt a npc with the exchange option. How i'm i supposed to exchange the gob horns then? I talked to the npc inside alchs shop and the one outside. Review your data.

I've read your talk page. I'll try exchanging some resources then, by using the talk dialog. I apologize in advance if i get to be wrong.
 * Ok I went there and review the NPC his name is "Virgil Onamaz, Scroll Seller" and they have remove the Exchange option it had before when I updated with the varius exchange scrolls for f2p people, I will do the proper adjustments. --Cizagna (Talk) 15:09, 4 December 2006 (UTC)

Characteristic scrolls
Please read Talk:Characteristic Scroll --User:Rz
 * Already gave a counter answer on the link above --Cizagna (Talk) 00:46, 7 December 2006 (UTC)

Revert of sets
Oh, sorry about that - wasn't aware of the discussion about them. I much prefer a wider than a longer table, as it allows to have a quicker glimpse at the info, but I'm not arguing about that. I hope you like all my other edits and thank you for keeping an eye on all this. --Lirielle 23:00, 6 December 2006 (UTC)
 * yeah I totally understand your point of view, but give a look on the high level sets as you will see there are so many effects thats its already force to a longer table and to harness that we merge those 3 things, about the images after i have give a thought long time ago i finish to agree on dashivas request.
 * Abut your other edits I like them but there are some bugs there must be corrected... the main one is that sometimes you are adding an image that already exist but as there is no rules on how we will display the names thats a thing will resolve later. But with time you will see the rest --Cizagna (Talk) 00:51, 7 December 2006 (UTC)


 * Normally ;) there's a reason for changing a pic. Some were just blurry, but mostly I'm changing pics because they have the weight info included in the pic, which is superfluous and visually debatable. While doing so, I'm standardizing on a background as copied from in-game screen, cropping just below the weight text and above the magnifying glass or other icons, and cropping right and left at the pic box sides. This is done on a 100% Normal display and gives a standard size of 90x67 px. Ideally, the background should be transparented, but this is more work than I would like. The way I'm doing it at the moment is the quickest to get a clean standard-looking image.


 * Prior my sicness my computer crash i was taking pictures directly from the files, as my intention was to give a standart sice to all the pictures with a nice white background, but what i mean is: we have image names Wabbit_hat.jpg, and you add Wabbit_hat.png in any case if you are discarding the jpg file add a delete tag so at least we can keep record on what files are used as the wikia in its special pages does not says that. Also Wikia has a large storage capacity per file so it can store files below 19 megas, the resize can be done by code, as wikia will give that specific resize requested from the page. so basically i was making images of 800x800 around that so it could be resize to 120x120 automatically by just putting some codes to the template giving all items and gears a standard size image that has a nice size as many ppl is use to the 100 or 120 size of the avatar images on most forums.


 * Point taken for the delete marker. I'll try to sort it out for the job done so far. As far as items are concerned the "real" in-game size looks good to me, and it helps keeping the itembox/resourcebox a reasonable size. And great if you can take the pics directly from the files, but not everyone is able to do that :/ --Lirielle 16:05, 7 December 2006 (UTC)


 * Yes I know not every one can get the info directly, its a huge project thats why its taking its time, and there is not much of a hurry as there are other things that needs to be fix first like the standardization of the templates, then the correction and standardization on how the pages look using that templates, as images its a nice visual effect but are not necessary information.--Cizagna (Talk) 16:25, 7 December 2006 (UTC)

Administration
I can't exactly tell you what you should focus on for improving your Wikia. But I can't seam to find the rules of the Wikia in a open area, it could be useful if you have some nuances like I've had on The Gaiapedia. Remember that you have an advantage, You appear to have a large base of active users, try finding a area of the site that needs a lot of work, and direct the community towards fixing it. Dantman (Talk) 03:16, 14 December 2006 (UTC)

Patrolled
I've added the patrolled edit feature here as you requested. Angela talk 15:31, 14 December 2006 (UTC)
 * Thank you very much --Cizagna (Talk) 15:32, 14 December 2006 (UTC)

Previous Inactivity
I am very glad I chose today to log on, seeing as I have just begun to play DOFUS again. Thank you for messaging me, I will attempt to remain active as much as possible on the Wiki, but I will not be able to make any large edits untill I re-acquaint myself with the game, and the new updates. - MrMunchie

Double Titles
The initiate's Staff (in game name) and The Initiate's Staff are both referring to the same staff and are not forwarding to one another, and both is listed under the Category: Staff. Didn't know where to report it, sorry if this is a wrong place.. --Assos 03:38, 18 December 2006 (UTC)
 * Ok, thanks for the report, I will take care of it shortly --Cizagna (Talk) 03:45, 18 December 2006 (UTC)

Project "Xavier Flour recipe"
Hey i was wondering what you needed(like wheat/flower/item wise) for the project, as you can see on my page, i'm high lvl baker/farmer(but not 100 ><). I'm doing this for the wikia >> Masshuku 20:35, 20 December 2006 (UTC)
 * Well when im referring to gathering the items its just making lots of the flours and trying to craft it in the recipe page i made there are already lots of possible combinations i go from the lowest lvl combinations to the highest lvl flour combinations, but as i have dozens of projects for the wikia its hard to keep up with everything and the sometimes free time i have i invest it on playing dofus. So if you want to try you can try doing combinations the rules are simple... xavier+water those are main ingredients, the rest just follows a pattern of levels, from lower level craftable flour to higher level craftable flour if you need i can give you some xaviers flours so you test on those as you are not 100 --Cizagna (Talk) 20:52, 20 December 2006 (UTC)

Weaponbox Template
The amended weaponbox template looks good, and I only had to make one small spelling correction. // Peet talk 10:10, 21 December 2006 (UTC)

Site Notice
There are two mistakes in the sitenotice - change an to and and on to in. Cheers. // Peet talk 10:10, 21 December 2006 (UTC)
 * Done, Thanks --Cizagna (Talk) 14:09, 21 December 2006 (UTC)

Eniripsa/dmg-oriented Builds
I am NOT deleting anything. I am categorizing things. And based on the actual content, "dmg-oriented" is a Team Support build. It is clearly NOT a Solo Combat build. Therefore, I suggest that you NOT confuse the people by misplacing the build. Thank you, --GrauGeist 09:12, 31 December 2006 (UTC)
 * I'm a little confuse, but ok, unless you are talking of my "redundancy" reduction to the guide that i have not been able to do it, but not deleting from my part only reallocating info to 1 spot instead of 3, but now i dont have the time so if you are doing that for me there is no problem. Aside from that there still not a real built categorization.--Cizagna (Talk) 13:45, 31 December 2006 (UTC)
 * Before it was one big pile with redundant entries (a total mess), so I tried to categorize so it makes a little more sense to the reader. I was confused by your comment, sorry.  --GrauGeist 08:20, 2 January 2007 (UTC)

Unblock required for Themonkeymoo
I recieved an email from Themonkeymoo this morning, as he is blocked from editing. You blocked IP address 68.107.142.128, his IP, on the 21st of December, for this change:. He made this change without logging in, thinking it was an error in the transtalion to proper subscripts, and reverted it here after realising his mistake and logging in: (note the edit summary states: reverted mistakenly switched subscripts). Could you please unblock the IP address. Many thanks. //Peet talk 11:09, 4 January 2007 (UTC)
 * I will unban him per your request, just to note that you where the one that added the report in the RFI --Cizagna (Talk) 17:59, 4 January 2007 (UTC)

NPC categories
I know you won't like my editing a template, but I did change the NPC template as the change only affects the categories that are generated by the template. The point is, the template used to have ", that was supposed to generate both and  . This did not work. I changed it to always generate  and, if the area is filled in, to generate both  and  . (I don't see the latter is useful, but it was supposed to be there in the old template. Hope this suits you. --Lirielle 14:27, 8 January 2007 (UTC)
 * That its a little bit more complex that what you think, as what it really affects its the order on how the page is display in the category page.


 * If you put all pages will be alphabetize in the NPC Category


 * If you put all NPC pages that has this extra code will be alphabetize as Pandala in the NPC Category.


 * That way we would have all the NPC's already order by Area in the Category page


 * I was trying to do a complex cross reference but the code simply was not flexible enouft, as i have learn new tricks now maybe i can try to do it again but i want to finish with the weapon template first before jumping to another template.--Cizagna (Talk) 15:31, 8 January 2007 (UTC)

Edit: It looks we can't use "/" in categories. The template does generate e.g., and I could create the corresponding page "Category:NPC/Brakmar", but it doesn't list the NPCs... :(. So apparently we should use another category to list NPC by region ("Category:NPC-Brakmar"??), but I'm leaving the templte as it is for now to avoid continuous changes. Also see the discussion on the "NPC" page to know why I'm trying this. --Lirielle 14:37, 8 January 2007 (UTC)
 * Basicly here your idea is to create a separate category for all the NPC/Brakmar, while you could add the NPC category and the Brakmar category and if you need the an NPC list of all Brakmars npc's you coujd just use a dinamic listing and if you need that the all brakmar NPC are group on, of if you want all the brakmars NPCs to apear togueder in the NPC category you use my examples above --Cizagna (Talk) 17:15, 8 January 2007 (UTC)


 * Oh I see :/. Still got a lot to learn... Thx for the details. Yes, the underlying reason is to get rid of such pages as Brakmar NPCs and use categories. The reordering trick that you describe is good to know, but I don't think it is reasonable to have all NPCs on one page, event sorted by region, because there are simply too many NPCs to display on one page. So I'd rather have the NPC page refer to separate NPC/Amakna, NPC/Astrub... pages. Therefore, I'm leaving the changes as they are unless there are objections. (I'm copying this to the NPC talk page.) --Lirielle 17:33, 8 January 2007 (UTC)
 * I will do the same, as the NPC pages are basically abandon and i want to focus on weapon/item/resource templates first, and im trying to see if we can do some trick to be able to use the dynamic list so the weapon/equipment can be show by level so we can do a more powerful category listing (thats why i still have not implemented the new weapon template), maybe available with dimaiccategory2 but still not sure if we have that available on Wikia--Cizagna (Talk) 17:46, 8 January 2007 (UTC)

Image size
I see you've changed to a bigger pic. :(((( I've been precisely trying to do the exact opposite, that is to reduce the size of this pic... I don't object to having bigger size images in separate places like the Monsterpic box, but I'm trying to keep images to a more reasonable size when they are in a complex box like Resourcebox, Itembox, NPC box, etc. You know that such boxes can get long and keeping down the size of pics will help saving screen real-estate and have more info of the box displayed on one screen. Also, I'm trying to more or less standardize the pic sizes to give the wikia a better, consistent look: These sizes where chosen to match most of the existing pics. --Lirielle 17:09, 10 January 2007 (UTC)
 * For item pics, I use a real size (100%) screen dump
 * For monsters, I use the top-left screen graphic, real size
 * For NPCs and other non-combat screens, I use the zoom function of FlashPlayer, step 5
 * I will answer you in your talk page --Cizagna (Talk) 17:15, 10 January 2007 (UTC)
 * I met with Lirielle in game and we talked about the images. Since we are both using the same size which seems to be appropriate for both resource and item templates (especially the second) we thought we might stick with it. There are only some higher level items which have many stats which maybe would require higher images just because the box looks a bit empty without them, but i'm not really sure whether it is the best idea to stray from standard for aesthetic reasons. Also, since we use the default ingame background (and not a landscape like ankama or white background which would for example consume the image of eveil dandelion flower) people will recognize items more easily. We also discussed about the need for maybe higher quailty original files but felt that need unnessecary - nobody will use these images as their wallpapers or for printing and these are afterall meant to convey the real nature of items not to beautify them. So, i'm thinking it would be good idea to stick with the current image schema (used by Lirielle and me) for resources and items.--ilmarine 03:07, 12 January 2007 (UTC)
 * For now i dont mind, as you told no one really uses and my image project is slow so it does not affect me, the only thing that may affect me is the name as the scheme you and lirielle are following is first letter capital and the rest lower caps with out following the item names, but that is still on the work out so as i obtain the images directly from the dofus files some i dont really know whats the name so the images both of you are putting helps me from time to time, the image size its a future thing its just to be prepare to avoid re-obtaining the image in the future for lets say the image on the template its decided to be 150px so what do you do with all those 100px images, any way will see later, so far you two are doing a great job so keep on --Cizagna (Talk) 03:37, 12 January 2007 (UTC)
 * Ok, the image size aside (i still would prefer the size as it is in game, although larger would be better [well, actually if you zoom into some of them they actually get worse]). I still think that no matter what, for items and resources we should stick to the brownish background as can be seen in game (whether we should use a gradient is an entirely different and, as a matter of fact, unimportant matter). So, my question is - do we really need to get the images from in-game files (I could do that), have them originally as monstrously big and tell wiki to make them smaller on every page? It seems to me that there is actually no reason for it (aside from the fact that, yes, you could see them bigger).
 * Edit: I print-screen my images from game having used the flash function to zoom in (you know, right mouse button menu) so i could actually make the images twice the size (i save all the screenshots in psd-s so they are not lost), but i still dont see why we should present images differently from how they are shown in game.
 * And editedit: As for naming - in reality we should only use the normal latin alphabet, no caps, no spaces, no apostrophes, etc, because this is the standard practice when putting files on the internet. Of course, the name should reflect the image contents, but still i even think the first capital letter is wrong --ilmarine 04:13, 12 January 2007 (UTC)
 * Think it this way, it would give more people access to make work images or for us do more creative template, or that some one designs a skin for our wiki as they have the images. About the background, while the images have a transparent background template cells can be command with  to have a certain background like the one in dofus resolving that issue. About the extra note one of the auto codings im want to implemet is   so the only thing you will have to add is JPG, GIF, PNG or SVG. And as i tested capitalizations do matter as how mediawiki handles the information--Cizagna (Talk) 04:24, 12 January 2007 (UTC)
 * I understand you points and consider them all valid. However, transparent background for images would not work because even IE6 which is considered one of the main browsers doesn't implement it correctly for RGB PNGs (which would be the only way to go if we would like to achieve true transparency). And quality wise, the best option (SVG) is even less implemented. So, as I see it, our only option would be to use large PNGs (obtained from game files) that have a fixed background (I still would suggest that brownish color) and can be resized for individual templates. For me this right now only poses two problems:
 * I wouldn't know the names of half the images I get from files
 * I'm too lazy just to get the images from files (besides, if there are images to begin with, it is later easier to change them because you know if the image is correct) :)
 * As for naming thins - I think you are correct and there are only some instances (the different powders, potions) where a generic image name should be used. Will try to implement.--ilmarine 05:18, 12 January 2007 (UTC)
 * The upload utility does not support spaces in names (changes them into underscores), so I wonder if it could work like you want it to... And the initial cap thing also comes from the uploader (I've taken to only use lower-case letters in filenames). --Lirielle 10:49, 12 January 2007 (UTC)
 * As for the size, the zoom is OK when you look at an item in your inventory, but can be tricky in some places (in shops, you need to use full-screen in order to see and capture the item pic). Using the zoom gives 180x134 images in the conditions described. Looks just a bit too much to me. I would suggest to force the image size to 120px wide. In case a wikian does not take as much background as we do around the pic, the aspect ratio won't be the same and the pic will be higher at a width of 120px. So we also need to restrict the height and I suggest to code the template to an image size of 120x80px. --Lirielle 10:49, 12 January 2007 (UTC)
 * And a very important remark concerning transparent PNGs - if you even look at your own project, the dragon pig page, in IE6 you will see that the background is a different color blue than what you have set. This is because of the almost non-existent support for PNGs that IE has. So, in all honesty, we can kiss transparent PNGs that could be later used for better editing good-bye, and have to use defined backgrounds. This is not nessecarily a bad thing, mind you, because I think if we can agree upon the backgrounds for different types, we will manage (brownish for items/resources, blueish for monsters?).
 * On a different topic. I looked into the dofus swf-s and saw that they have been ordered so nicely that it is a joy to take images from them and I will probably start doing that. There are some glitches with some files that have to be corrected manually but mostly everything is streamlined. So, I think I will make large images (800x800) and after uploading use the image:filename.png|100 tag to display. This way people can see the items in all their glory (all or their zoomed in ugliness, in some cases). My own gut feeling tells me that the actual shape of the item/resource image (and, in fact, also of monster images) should be rectangular. Please give your input. ---ilmarine 12:25, 12 January 2007 (UTC)
 * If it just easier to get the pics from the files, then ok. The only issue is if one cannot get the same image without going into the swf, which not everybody can do, then we have a problem. IMHO, the images used must be such that any wikian can contribute them. Also they must be the same as in-game (which I suppose they are, but I'm adding this for the record), which is why I do not like images copied from Ankama's Dofus community pages (Encyclopedia). --Lirielle 13:15, 12 January 2007 (UTC)
 * Also, as not-so-technical reason for not using transparent background: Some of the files cannot be opened in a way that you could get the art-work undamaged (open clips/artworks/big/91.swf - the female cra and see what i mean). I have tried to overcome this problem in manyways (using different extractors, swish, importing swf to stage) and the quiver on that picture is always damaged - swf shows fine, but importing damages. So, the only way right now that i can see to take all images as they are is to use Eltima sowftwares Flash decompiler which lets you change the background color of individual sprites, zoom it to the highest possible size (which on my monitor is about 850 or so), take screenshot and save it photoshop. This process seems to be near lossless. As a side note - 800x800 i declared earlier seems to be even too big - 500x500 is enough. --ilmarine 14:19, 12 January 2007 (UTC)


 * Ok this is going to be long and i will try to go by points to avoid mixing my self
 * IE6 its "a" standard but only because it comes installed on every computer but IE7 is already release and Microsoft will force it to be the new standard most probably with "Windows Vista". I keep using IE6 until I saw that Firefox had a function that keep me using IE6 after that i swap immediately. IE6 has no support for SVG files and look Wikipedia its a standard image format.
 * Yes taking the image from the files has a problem and its "whats the name" thats why your image project does not affect me, as it helps me find faster the items, (but i recently found a way to do that ingame using the search in sells room except for "non market selling" items) The background can be manage in the cells looks at my sandbox User:Cizagna/Sandbox already implemented on the weapon template, the "No image" file does not look that good need to find a better version or improve the actual one. But look the last one with the Warning red sign looks great.
 * Naming image files works, already tested with Otof'Mai'We Daggers daggers that had "'" and spaces the utility saves the file internally as "_" but the image name is still work out as with spaces its like normal pages the true address of that file is "Otof%27Mai%27We_Daggers" but the page is "Otof'Mai'We Daggers" if yous see the if you see the info code you will see that im using the on the image. For common names "Crow" i have not tested if the "" are accepted by the upload of wiki but i guess that yes, so that way our problems are also solve for that too.
 * Image size, When you restrict an image size  it takes the first  it does not matter if the height or the width is 100px it takes the one that is bigger and reduce that to 100px so if you have a image 200x100 it will reduce to 100x50 or if you have a 100x200 it will reduce to 50x100. So the problem will rely more on how the user saves his image but that we can inform in the future style pages. Item/Resource images i don't matter if they are 500x500 because those are not heavy design (except for Kaliptus dofus even at 500x500 is hard to distinguish the leafs in side the dofus), battle image from monsters also and can be taken from the files so we have them always looking to one side (preferably to the left) and size can be as same as the other. But yeah art work i would prefer to have them as big as possible as some images have lots of details.
 * Files its beautifully order as its order by type so you have a folder only for daggers and so on, some exceptions like scrolls they have them separate for stat scrolls, pet scrolls, etc. (and as a hint you can see the future images like the new runes i knew of them 2 months prior the update, just did not knew for what the where use).
 * Transparency yes some maybe damage, so those one we could take them in a more picture thing, also pictures we can add them categories to mark which ones does not have transparency to try later to obtain them. I use that program to get the images my problem was that i did not have a powerful image editing and some friend just recently pass me adobe so now i just need to find out where is or how i can make a transparent image and start testing.
 * Community site. Agree on the community site images, i to don't like them that much as they are limited and not all the monsters/items are display community (and its down half of the time when an update comes) is now a more extra confirmation page, its reliable at some point but only that. As the actual position of this Wikia we are some steps ahead, the difference is that its info has a more reliable source.

--Cizagna (Talk) 15:45, 12 January 2007 (UTC)
 * About point 4: if we standardize on taking eg. 180x134 images and use eg. 120px as a limiter, these pics will be approx. 80 pixels high. If a user then comes with a 180x180 pic (because he cropped the sides), it will be diplayed at 120x120px, ie. 50% higher than the "standard". That's why I advocate for a "120x80px" limiter to keep all images the same height. --Lirielle 16:21, 12 January 2007 (UTC)
 * But as we are redoing all the images those issues will be corrected by us, also we would create later a policy page for images where it will be define those sort of problems and inform that the image should keep that way--Cizagna (Talk) 16:31, 12 January 2007 (UTC)

braking for easier edits

 * Please check out Gobball, Cawwot and Template_talk:Classbox (also the code there and use of PAGENAME). Now its just a matter of desciding thumb size. Also: IE6 is still at 50-70% userbase range, so it will take at least a year to die down. I don't think it will be a problem if we use images with background color since you can get rid of it easily and with almost no quality loss.--ilmarine 16:50, 12 January 2007 (UTC)
 * Your comment on the Cawwot edit (since original is square you can only specify one measurement) shows that you didn't get my point. I made a page (User:Lirielle/Imagesize) to make it clearer. If you only restrict width, your square file, being narrower, will be less reduced than mine, resulting in the image being taller (see the 4 first rows). To get a better consistency, we should restrict both (the aspect ratio is kept in all cases). --Lirielle 17:38, 12 January 2007 (UTC)
 * Will modify your page so you can see with the background thing --Cizagna(Talk) 17:49, 12 January 2007 (UTC)
 * Edit: Of course the images can be center in horizontal an vertical, so while the background is the same the size will be un notice in those terms --Cizagna (Talk) 17:58, 12 January 2007 (UTC)


 * Nope, aspect ratio is both sides divided by same number - 200x100 becomes 100x50, 200x200 becomes 100x100, 166x126 becomes 83x63. If you want to make a 100x80 image from 200x200 image it gets pressed together. Also, the reason why you never enter the second number is because if you enter one number (lets say width) the other dimension is automatically corrected in the way that the aspect ratio is kept. So, here we should not be actually talking about which size is the thumbnail, but which ratio is original (cawwot.png is 1:1, another option would be 4:3 as the tv aspect ratio - giving images like 100x80). Comments? --ilmarine 17:54, 12 January 2007 (UTC)
 * BTW! I was actually wrong. The wiki doesn't use both of the numbers. This 100x75px actually produces 75x75 (click on image and select properties). Actually, check out all the properties to see what wiki has done. Since your images can be resized with numbers you provide without breaking aspect ratio, it has done so. But since cawwot's aspect would be broken, it only uses one of the numbers.--ilmarine 18:09, 12 January 2007 (UTC)
 * Saw what you are referring i was looking for some reference and have not found any thing that mentions using that trick with the 100x75px not sure if it takes even the 2 numbers in consideration as what the wiki is looking if for a number that its attack for a "px" so i guess that if you put 75x100px it will take the 100px and make the image 100 pixels--Cizagna (Talk) 19:58, 12 January 2007 (UTC)
 * So a decisions must be take with the image size in the output, as im already starting to update weapon pages template information and my template is fixed to 100px as lirielle thought of it as optimum and need to know to do the proper adjustments before i have more than 200 pages with that template and have to do "adjustments"--Cizagna (Talk) 04:34, 13 January 2007 (UTC)
 * For imaze size reduction, see Extended image syntax on Wikipedia. --Lirielle 12:01, 13 January 2007 (UTC)

Image size decision?
Yes, I used to advocate for a 100px-wide image. I've implemented a 120x90px size in my last constributions, though, and I'm satisfied with it. So my vote goes for 120x90px (about size reduction, see the reference above). --Lirielle 12:01, 13 January 2007 (UTC)
 * i quote


 * Size
 * {width}px or {width}x{height}px, scales the image to be no greater than the given width and height, keeping its aspect ratio.


 * So as ilmarine discover it will take the lower aspect ratio of 90px basically --Cizagna (Talk) 15:18, 13 January 2007 (UTC)
 * Since I'm now unblocked, I can contribute :) I still think we should never have to resort to specifying both the sizes for an image, because wiki will still only use one of them in order to keep the aspect ratio. So, in my mind the image code for items/resources/weapons looks like this:
 * PAGENAME.png|120px|PAGENAME
 * This way we can make sure that the images longer side is 120px (and even if some vertically higher images get in, they won't be too high).
 * All in all my propositions for images are:
 * Item/resource/weapon - 4:3 aspect ratio for the original (the best might be maybe 600x450), background #DAD6B8 (same color for the background of the table cell), code looks as above.
 * Monster/pet/whatever (for instance i found those nice images of all the workshops that could be used to create pages for each individual type of workshop) - 1:1 aspect ratio (600x600 or 500x500 maybe), code is PAGENAME.png|200px|PAGENAME, background #ffffff (same color for the background of the table cell).
 * All the rest is a variant of the two thumb sizes, background #ffffff (this of course only is meant for images that use ingame items/objects/symbols that can be gotten straight from the swf resources - for screenshots, maps, etc it's a matter of context).
 * I think this would work. Also, Cizagna, as I stated above, I feel incomfortable about using transparent PNGs for at least a year or so. Backgrounded images won't hurt anybody and we can also avoid the glitches that some images (eg. female cra) get when trying to make them transparent. Comments? --ilmarine 15:44, 13 January 2007 (UTC)
 * as ilmarine discover it will take the lower aspect ratio of 90px basically . Well no. It makes sure that it fits both sizes. If we have a 360x180 image and a 120x90px restriction, the displayed image will be 120x60, not 180x90. So both dimensions count, and I really don't understand why we couldn't have both. With 'vertical' items such as Woolich braid, a wikian could easily submit a 120x260 image... Well, look at my Imagesize page if you're not convinced.
 * as for the original file size, I really don't care, provided it is bigger than or equal to 120x90. The 180x134 size that I use leaves some margin for a reasonable enlargement of the display size. --Lirielle 19:38, 13 January 2007 (UTC)
 * Ahhh ok sorry i did not understand that, ok now i got your idea, and i have a counter proposal instead of adding 120x90px we could add the 120x120px se your image page i regroup them as the examples was way to long to notice if there where difference, but this way we have the best of the 2 worlds images that have higher height or width will be force to a 120px and images that size 1:1 will be exploit at maximum, what do you think now? viable?--Cizagna (Talk) 20:33, 13 January 2007 (UTC)
 * I agree, code 120x120px seems to be the best way to go. Btw, just to mention it here, using transparent background GIFs is a dead end - no quality to speak of and the transparency has to use some color around the edges to save (so that when you dispaly an image meant for light background on dark, you will see a lightish border around it).--ilmarine 06:36, 14 January 2007 (UTC)

Resource and Items format
Since I've been looking at many resource pages lately i would like to offer this as my idea for formatting everything else besides the templatebox:
 * First a small introduction (Evil Dandelon flower is a flower.) - its possible to add here if something is particulary important for something or particulary useless (Apparently this item has no uses.)
 * Then Obtained from or Obtaining (I prefer the first wording because it sounds more correct and goes better with other titles). I usually don't add Dropped by: if the item can only be dropped, but when there are more ways to get it i used:
 * Dropped by:
 * Gobball
 * Exchanged with an NPC at -2,0 for 1 kamas.

Since to me this seems to be the cleanest way to go for resources (and basically also for items), I would like to ask for your approval and help to spread the word about this.--ilmarine 03:24, 12 January 2007 (UTC)
 * Then in case of Hemp flowers and suchlike come the Gathering, Antibot and Locations infos. I differentiate these from obtaining info because this is specific and applies only to a certain profession.
 * Then comes Used in the craft of (the of in the end is why i prefer Obtained from)
 * Then Exchanges (here I would like to add for example the detailed info about scroll exchnages as on the page of Bluish Jelly) and Other uses (or Also used for as on some pages)


 * go to Template:Skelitem and work that out, that its a skeleton template all the will be remove and a clean skeleton can be made then a proper template can be work out, try to cover as much as you can. See also the Template:Skelweapon but edit it, as you will see i started to structure it as i want a clean thing to start. Work it out there as those template i will transform them in style guides later on. And you and Lirielle can work that out as both of you have work out a lot of the item/resource pages. Oh and from that item we will base later on the resource skel template.
 * The "Antibot" category sounds so awful it was make in a rush because that whats part of its purpose but i will change in the future to "Resource Guardian" as that describes in a more ingame term than "Antibot".--Cizagna (Talk) 03:46, 12 January 2007 (UTC)


 * I'm unconfortable playing with this until the templates are improved. So far, Itembox does not include a Description field like the other templates. But Cizagna wouldn't change templates until the weaponbox is finished... :/ --Lirielle 11:03, 12 January 2007 (UTC)

Guidelines
Could we add a posting guidelines link to the left menu. This would include the points that a regular user wouldn't think about immediately when he/she posts. For example:
 * Aplhabetizing list
 * Image ratios (if agreed upon)
 * Thumbnail sizes (if agreed upon)
 * Etc

Ideas, comments? --ilmarine 19:26, 13 January 2007 (UTC)
 * This info can be develop at Dofus:Community Portal/Style Guide
 * Alphabetizing its a natural thing so its no need to mention unless you poiting something specific
 * Image ratios once we finish agreeing
 * Thumbnail its more like a sort of remark that will be noted on the templates explications and features as it will be forced.
 * etc we will see

--Cizagna (Talk) 20:37, 13 January 2007 (UTC)

Set Table
Would you mind if I put User:Cizagna/SetProyect on a page titled template:skelset? It would make updating the set pages much eisier. --Scyth02 02:15, 15 January 2007 (UTC)
 * I don't get how it would be easier as its not a full template the only easy one its the name typing--Cizagna (Talk) 02:29, 15 January 2007 (UTC)

Monster Categories
Since I don't know how or am not allowed, I would like to request adding the following categories to the monster subcategory: Moon Island Monsters, Kanniballs, Pirates and Boss Monsters.--ilmarine 15:14, 15 January 2007 (UTC)
 * If you are having one that is "Moon island" you dont need the kaniballs and pirate ones as every thing will be there as a subcategory of monsters. But for now do as you see fit as i have not think that much how to order the monster category properly.
 * How to is adding  and the category will be created automaticly, now you go to the category and add   like in this case "Monsters" and that will be done. Removing a page in a category takes around 1 day to 1 week. --Cizagna (Talk) 15:24, 15 January 2007 (UTC)

NPC template
ok, scratch the info about npc template, i didnt notice your reply. however, please do check out the talk page for template:classbox.--ilmarine 11:00, 16 January 2007 (UTC)


 * Oh looks like my edit did not go out, with the class box i dont have issue that its implemented its only affects 11 pages, maybe colors on the bars but as the way you put it looks nice check or considerer how will it looks with a horizontal layout like "male/logo/female" or vice verse or the classic one (with the new pictures) or the one you propose, there are options to choose but i leave it for now to your hands --Cizagna (Talk) 19:16, 16 January 2007 (UTC)

I'll put it here also if you missed the line in recent changes - go and check out your sandbox03 (I hope you don't mind me meddling a bit).--ilmarine 03:00, 18 January 2007 (UTC)
 * hey, also another note. first go and check out User_talk:Ilmarine/SWFList and second. since other items (wearables) depend very much on the weapon box becoming a stable release, could you please tell us how usable the current weaponbox is, if it is final or not, and what are the problems, if any.--ilmarine 08:49, 20 January 2007 (UTC)
 * also, could you maybe add the line "belongs in the set" to your weaponbox? i think this would be a good feature to add. --ilmarine 08:56, 20 January 2007 (UTC)

Sets or Gears
I know most if not all players tend to use "Set", but the official name is "Gear" (see User:Lirielle/Itemsets). I suggest that main pages for the sets/gears be labelled according to official names, even if we continue to use "set" everywhere else. Of course, redirects would be created from sets to gears. --Lirielle 12:59, 20 January 2007 (UTC)
 * Yes, they need to be change, but not now, we better finish with the rest and then we have to see this, as renaming a page its not just moving or deleting, its correcting all the links that are pointing to the redirect other way you are still encouraging the wrong name, thats why i waste all my time doing link corrections due to the constant names changes. --Cizagna (Talk) 23:55, 20 January 2007 (UTC)